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11/30/2011

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Thinking more on the ongoing friendly debates between myself, Marshal Laeroth, Devjon & others about list composition, elements to include in a list, proper purpose for a list, fluff, theory, mathhammer/metrics, the elusive "Style" component  and now dealing with my favorite 40k Xenos race, the major thing is the "Style".  There are no hard and fast rules on it.  There can be strong guidelines though.  This is a little long and fuzzy, like the title.  Unfortunately, this isn't one of those posts with answers.

When it comes to guidelines and archetypes, the corollary always comes up: "A good player plays by the "Book", a great player knows when to throw the "Book" away and still win."  For those that play MMORPGs, you might know what I mean.  Tanks tank and squishy Nukers nuke, but slowly so that the Tanks can keep aggro.  RIght?  Except for my buddy on a top raiding guild.  He didn't need the uber casting gear for raids, he had to nuke slowly, so his raiding gear was about extra AC, Hit Points and Resists.  Which meant when the primary Tank went down and the secondary didn't grab control right away, he'd unload his biggest nuke, the a series of stun spells to chain stun the mob.  Yes, he died, but he gave the raid time and a chance to regain control instead of wiping.

So, the question is: What is "Style"?


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Necrons vs. Tau 1500

11/28/2011

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This was more of a learning game, not sure if the guy was getting back into 40k after a long absence or just learning.  He was running a Tau list with (I think, not familiar with Tau):
2x Hammerhead(?) Tanks with railguns + some of the S5 AP5 guns
1x Tank with seeker missiles, marker lights & some smaller guns
2x Transports with 9x Fire Warriors (BS3, S5, AP5 RF guns) each
1x Transport with 5x Pathfinders (Sgt, heavy weapon of some kind, 3x troops, markerlights)
2x Squads of battle suits, one with the leader, with a variety of gear, lots of flamers, RF weapons, heavier stuff.

My list was trimmed to:
1x Overlord w/ Warscythe in Command Barge (Gauss) (CB)
1x Overlord Phaeron (with the Gauss Immortals for Relentless)
1x Immortals (Gauss) w/ Cryptek of Destruction (Solar Pulse)
1x Immortals (Tesla) w/ Cryptek of Destruction (Solar Pulse)
15x Warriors with Lord w/ Rez Orb
10x Warriors in a Ghost Ark (GA)
9x Scarabs
2x Spyders


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List Building & The Razor's Edge

11/24/2011

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_Considering these posts by Marshal Laeroth and Nikephoros, here is my interpretation:  The ideal to achieve while building a list is to be like a battlecruiser which can "out fight what it cannot outrun and outrun what it cannot out fight".

So a list must measure itself against the three phases of the game: movement, shooting, assault.  A list needs to be strong in two of the three areas and at least able to hold its own in the third.  Remember this is a relative ranking, so Razorspam vs Razorspam Marines aren't "strong" against each other for movement, whereas most DE builds are always strong in movement vs any Marine list, however a mechanized Marine list can hold its own if it is superior in shooting and assault.

NOTE: Remember that shooting & assault can both change these relative scores.  If I just killed every vehicle in your list in the first couple of turns, then your movement is now weaker.  Similarly if I just shot your rock CC unit to pieces, then it isn't a big CC threat anymore.


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Finecast or Failcast?

11/22/2011

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Yes, this has been beat up on all over the place.  I don't like the stuff.  I just put together one and it was simultaneously too hard, too soft, too brittle and too flexible.  It is pretty, but after having to take my finest razor and go into all the deep corners to trim out both annoying flimsy flash and cut out thick stuff, then finding out that the crap does NOT fit together correctly is beyond annoying, it is stupid.  I spent forever trying to trim stuff off one part that kept flexing like a rubber band, then forever working on a part that almost seemed to want to break into pieces (and did in spots), then there was the parts that looked like it was two crammed together bits, which IMO points to an inability of the manufacturer to bother with making sure the mold is fitting together correctly.


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Deep Strike vs. Necrons

11/22/2011

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Of some interest to me is how I would fare if I faced a Necron Imotekh (or double Solar Pulse) list. with my Templars.  Since the general objective is to:
1. Shoot the crap out of everything
2. Beat the crap of anything left standing

Disregard all the fancy, highfalutin jargon about maintaining the initiative, movement blocking and other such goodies, those are only the tools by which I achieve the two basic objectives.  Similarly, mech lists use Rhino rushes, vehicle bunkers, etc. to perform the same two tasks.

Dealing with Night Fighting can be a problem with a lot of 48" range units.  Simply running up closer and engaging at shorter ranges isn't the best option, especially for my Speeders since that would deny me my range advantage, although since S4 weaponry can already glance AV10, the Gauss auto glance isn't such a big deal, but I do depend on a turn or three of prep fire to soften up and stress my opponent's army to set him up for the endgame.

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First Necron report

11/20/2011

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Well, I went in to test some of the Necron "tricks" using the models that I had on hand.  I need to work on my skillz with Necrons and coordinating some of their goodies to work better together, but after a 2k game vs Blood Angels and a 5550ish (3x players: Blood Angels, Eldar, Necron vs. 2x 'Nid players) and both of them wins, I'm wondering about my "stupid-good" simple list.  Most of the "good" comes from people not being used to a seventy-six model shooty army that can walk up into your face and blast you at short ranges. 


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Misc Thoughts on 40k

11/16/2011

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Just some random thoughts on what I wouldn't mind seeing in 40k.  Some of these are simple concepts in theory, but might end up being no-go ideas because of game balance & complexity factors.  I mean, who cares if it is the best mechanic in the world if it ends up taking fifteen minutes to figure out who died from a squad of bolter rapid fire?

The easy "fluffy" wish:  "Personalized" subarmies in the various "generic" codices.  Pretty much giving bonuses to different chapters, legions, craftworlds, etc.  Crimson Fists could get Preferred Enemy vs. Orks.  Iron Hands get the Bionics special ability at least on anything above a plain Battle Brother, etc.  Deathworlder IG get +1S or T or I to simulate whatever has been selected for in the population.  Various forms of elite trained IG could get +1Ld.  This would quickly get into the "hard to balance" area because for some codices it could run into combinations of units and special abilities that could be lethal on the table.  Otherwise, IMO, most of these could be simulated by either a flat or percentage cost for one Vet skill and/or Stat upgrade for ~3-5 points per model.


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Converting Necrons

11/12/2011

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Wonderful models, joyous models, detailed models.  Ummm, did we have to have three different persnickety options of weapons?  In the case of the Immortals' Gauss Blaster, four different side panel/power cable options?

<sigh>  Oh well, mainly a rant when I started realizing all of the Warriors I'm in the process of converting into Immortals (which will give me 5x Gauss Immortals, 5x Tesla Immortals & 5x Deathmarks (unconverted) per Immortals/Deathmarks box) will have to be custom fitted for each and every weapon depending on the pose. 

HINT:  Put Warrior torso together, assemble weapon + arms to the torso, then glue the torso to the legs (however you modify them.

Minor rant when a buddy I haven't heard from for months called up and killed two prime hours of model building time when the wife was going to help do some of the cutting of conversion bits (plasticard, etc.) and cleaning up mold lines.
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Easy "Win" Button.

11/9/2011

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The basic "Win" list is fairly simple:
Imotekh (Night Fight mainly, but lightning strikes for random fun)
3x Scarabx10
3x Spyderx3

That's 1125 points there.  Fill the rest with Warriors and some Ghost Arks. 

The Scarabs run around 19-24" (after getting +3 Scarab bases each from the Spyders) assaulting every vehicle in sight while the Spyders try to keep up.  If need be, wait a turn to exploit the guaranteed 1st turn Night Fight to set up for the first charge.  Remember it isn't necessary to have them rip open every vehicle, so multiassault and get multiple vehicles down to 4ish AV.  Next turn, scuttle away to find new targets (or meet the Spyders for more Scarab bases) and let the Warriors shoot their now auto-pen shots into the armor shredded vehicles.

The Scarabs can also tarpit most infantry quite well even if they aren't the greatest at killing them, but used carefully, the Spyders can help on the beatdown.  In fact, that is the weakest part of the core of this list, the AI is low, especially if you have to worry about leaving squads at objectives. 

Booooring, but it should be workable.
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Necronian Metrics

11/8/2011

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Okay, fiddling around with three lists to see what happens with the metrics.  The lists are probably not the greatest, they have the sole advantage of being what I could field right now with what is in my house, including doing some conversion (20 NW on sprue into 20 NI using the extra weapons in the Immortal;/Deathmark boxes).  I don't like some of what I see, but then I'm not claiming to be fielding a competition list.

Ground Rules:
  • Part of the AT capability of the army is the Gauss rule for auto-glancing.  Simulated by dividing by 4 for DRPG and 5 for DLRPG.  For the Rhinos, that is an extra "glance" requirement, but I'm trying to err on the low side.  First number is the actual penetration rating and second number in parentheses is the total with the glance divisor figured for Gauss weapons.
  • Tesla weapons have AP-, so to simulate the fact that they have a -1 on the Vehicle damage table, I'm cutting their DRPG rating in half since they only have a 1/6 chance to kill instead of 1/3.
  • Tesla weapons at BS4 have a 2/6 chance to miss, 3/6 chance to score 1 hit and 1/6 chance to score 3 hits, which averages out to 6/6 hits, so I simply ignore rolling to hit with them.  This means my numbers for the Annihilation Barge's TL Tesla Destructor are low because I didn't feel like fiddling with the rerolled misses.  Easier to just assume it hit 4 times.
  • Secondary effects of the Tesla Destructor are ignored (Arc rule).  Imotekh's lightning call and his once per game Staff of the Destroyer shot is also ignored.
  • Scarabs DRPG & DLRPG stats are based totally on reducing AV to 0.  So I just figured the hits, divided by 2 (4+ to entropic strike) and then divided by 10 for the Rhino and 14 for the Land Raider.  Totals including this will be in parentheses after the actual penetration rating.
  • The third list includes an Annihilation Barge, so it has double numbers based on whether or not it has a Tesla or Gauss secondary weapon.
Some initial observations:
  1. Flayed Ones really and truly blow.  Five of them cannot do anything but CC 1.667 MEQ down per Assault phase.  If they take no casualties themselves.  If you get 20 of them, you maybe could survive the I4 strikes to finish off a MEQ MSU.  Or you can buy 20 Warriors who perform exactly half as well on the charge (40 attacks vs 80 attacks), can almost wipe a MSU in shooting and actually have a chance (Gauss glancing) of suppressing and killing vehicles reliably.
  2. I think Scarabs are not best employed in totally destroying armor (although that is good!), but if you can get them in range first, rip down several vehicles in a multi assault so that next turn your opponent has two Rhinos with AV 4/4/3 or two Land Raiders with AV 8/8/8. 
  3. If you have Scarabs, you have to have the Spiders.  I think a Scarab list can cause some serious issues if properly supported.  However, Scarabs are not great MEQ killers except in vast numbers.
  4. Warriors & Immortals are going to be tough to shift off an objective, especially by shooting.  Assault could do it, but it might be costly.
  5. All of these lists do fine in DMSS, DMC & DLRPG.  Weak in DRPG to the point where the last one actually falls into the same DRPG bracket as the 0-4 Adepticon 2011 lists, even with the Gauss glance rule.  OTOH, with the massive amounts of glancing potential from the core troop units it might be considered that Necrons are more designed to suppress armored vehicles more than kill them outright, but, the 12/24" range issues means a lot of close up suppression.
  6. Another thought: Turn this more into "Herohammer" and buy an extra Overlord choice, then cherry pick some Crypteks for their Royal Court to provide more AT firepower.  Imotekh, Overlord, Crypteks (2xStorm, 2xDespair, 2xDestruction), 3x Annihilation Barges, 4-5 Troop choices.  I'll have to fiddle with that one, but 515 points in HQ choices with just Imotekh & the Crypteks, without picking the second Overlord...Ouch.  
  7. WTH?!  Why does going from 3+ to 2+ AS cost as much as a Storm Shield?  Why does a Storm Shield equivalent (3++) cost 45 points!
  8. Just to make sure: Flayed Ones blow. 

This post is a bit weak, but I'm going to stick it up anyway since the main reason it is "weak" comes from me being unhappy with getting a decently balanced list so far.  I dislike that every last one I've figured out depends on Imotekh the Stormlord himself to give it that extra little edge.  Oh well, back to the grind.

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